Solo Mapping Competition #3 - Poll

[A]mun]

the poll around

@ Ardnived:

A great classic example for everyone here, showing how a map maker can take reviews of his projects in consideration (of honest and detailed reviews at least, which consist of multi dimensionality, marking good things and bad things, also giving advises what could be improved). Great that you've recovered your motivation.

And refering to the discussion about the poll:

Public polls get often spoiled by mindless mass voting, unreflected opinions etc... that's just what a puplic poll is about by defenition. Highly depending on opinions from everyone. If you who expect this to be professional, or fair and detailed you will realise that these basic terms won't be matched by tendency.

Someone could start an experimental public poll about deciding how much sense it makes to let everyone, if experienced or not considering the polls theme, vote.

That's the thing. Everyone might download the maps and play them, finding some appealing, some not, maybe voting for them, maybe not. A poll for everyone, therefore, will have the most average results. Some comment, some give detailed and expensive reviews, some vote and do not even state why they did.

Suggestive might be, to separate these rough groupings of "how someone votes and on which background", which Syleona already did (30% puplic poll - 70% judge).

I hope that she has the sharp eye for quality, which Avator mentioned before (and good advise of how to improve it by the way, with effort, persistence and willpower i'd say).

 

[Berb]

mun]Public polls get often spoiled by mindless mass voting, unreflected opinions etc...

The Lost Temple has so many bugs I had to restart several times, yet its either in 1st or 2nd place. I started off trying to explode the wall, and I set the explosive next to it, but when I tried to blow it up it just didn't work. After restarting the game and trying it again it worked. This is a bug that should have been found well into testing, and I really don't think a game with the amount of bugs this one has should be allowed to win...

Lots of the icons have no disabled versions, so they appear that ugly lime-green color when the F10 menu is used (or they are disabled for whatever reason).

Upon reaching the 2nd room I found yet another bug, and was permanently paused talking to the librarian. From the looks of it this game was put together with custom models, special effects, but absolutely no detail. Its unbelievable that a game so poorly made has over 20 votes, and could potentially win this contest.

If you play Softmints, it is actually hard to bug the game, and it is obvious that there was fine attention to detail, and extensive testing. When I play "The Lost Temple" and can't get past a new room without bugging the game, it makes me wonder how on earth a public poll is taken for any credit whatsoever.

 

[Vengeancekael]

Arcadia wasn't really that awesome in my opinions, but it was fine and it looked really nice, but the gameplay wasn't that great.

 

[Pooppyhead]

I will test the rest of these maps this week and then vote. Oh I noticed there is no theme and description for the contest so people don't know what they should be looking for when voting.

Here are a few reviews
1 is terrible 5 is mediocre 10 is perfect

Cave of Forgetting by Equal

Cave of Forgetting by Equal

My first impression is that the title screen looks funny. Its just weird looking. The game starts in the middle of nowhere and I have no setup to what is going on. I know it is suppose to represent forgetting but it is just strange. The music in the game is really good although it doesn’t fit, I find it better then the default music.

The combat isn’t that good. One of the first things I bump into are beetles that attack. I’m not a fan of games where fighting consists of clicking then waiting a long time for them to die. I feel as though the beetles should be killed in one hit. Fighting in the game feels kind of boring as it is too slow and there is no real thinking.

The system of collecting clues and touching objects is cool. The mystery of the notes creates an interesting atmosphere but the item using system is a bit clunky. Plus there is just no space for all of the items you get.

The terrain I feel has too much empty space making walking around taking longer and feel longer because there is not much to look at. Some of the events are good but it ends up not feeling like it meshes with the whole experience.

It needs work on being more fluid and quicker. Right now it just seems to drag.

5/10

City Under Siege by w3mapmaker

City Under Siege by w3mapmaker
Intro was OK it set up the game gave you a bad guy to chase after. Having 2 heroes in one is cool, Wish it cost less mana to swap though, to make it viable to switch mid battle.

The battles themselves are kind of boring. It uses the basic heroes that are already in the game and you fight enemies in the game. The map feels noting like a adventure puzzler cause all you do is fight.

Fighting through the arena is kind of a pain. I don’t see the point/fun plus I don’t like to manually click the fountain to warp out of the arena that just feels weird.

It takes a really long time to walk around. The town is also big and very empty. I felt really bored playing it, like its just dragging on the sense.

There are no real bugs the game works like it should but it is pretty predicable. I don’t know how I would improve on this map to make it fit the category better. It sounds harsh but you might as well start over.

3/10

 

[Darkt3mpl3r]

Arcadia and lost temple for me.

 

[real138]

arcadia in my opinion was looks but the gameplay was impossible it gave you no clues what to do. i wasn't sure if i was going right i spent an hour toiling with the first level i had all the items i could find like 3-4 but i had no idea what to do with them. so i don't know if im just retarded or did everyone have this problem? or if anyone actually played the maps...

ALSO the public poll was a stupid idea.. no one is gonna play all the maps if any all the way through. i think syleona should have 100% say.

 

[Deolrin]

Real138, I quite easily beat Arcadia in two hours or so. However, The Lost Temple - I got stuck in the place with the ghosts and the orb in the middle - I used the banisher the night elf ghost gave me and got the orb, and I placed all orbs in their right places(it said "The item fits perfectly" or something) and then.. I'm stuck. I couldn't reach the blood orb and no one told me what to do, not the hunter nor the night elf, and the night elf just kept asking me where's the ghost.

 

[Elthehablo]

Awsome, i like alot of them but i voted for Lead the Story - Gem of Life.

 

[Pecki]

Arcadia gets my vote. The terrain is beautiful but after my fancy the map file size is oversized. (4/5 Points).

 

[De.Facto]

Arcadia gets my vote. The terrain is beautiful but after my fancy the map file size is oversized. (4/5 Points).

On this point, I may re-direct you to Chernobyl - Lost Riddles. (;
Unfortunately, it's still in development. I hope we can finish it within the next months.

Anyways, thanks for the positive feedback!

 

[Vengeancekael]

Real138, I quite easily beat Arcadia in two hours or so. However, The Lost Temple - I got stuck in the place with the ghosts and the orb in the middle - I used the banisher the night elf ghost gave me and got the orb, and I placed all orbs in their right places(it said "The item fits perfectly" or something) and then.. I'm stuck. I couldn't reach the blood orb and no one told me what to do, not the hunter nor the night elf, and the night elf just kept asking me where's the ghost.

lol it's pretty easy^^ Oh and you're not supposed to get the orb in the middle

 

[Pyritie]

Keep in mind 30% poll is really not very much at all

 

[Linaze]

It's still something, and I find it silly that it partially falls in the hands of random-voters to decide who shall get the epic award.

 

[De.Facto]

Keep in mind 30% poll is really not very much at all

For example: When someone got 11 points. The other contestant 15 - and wins. What about the eleven-point-guy? He just lost the part with the public-poll?

 

[Berb]

This contest's public poll = fail

 

[A]mun]

I've just added my review for Equals Cave of forgetting, which can be found here:

http://www.hiveworkshop.com/forums/...etition-3-poll-160019/index2.html#post1490699

@ Berbanog, yepp had the same problems (Add some basic informations to F9 is pretty much the deal to avoid people getting stuck). But the lost temple is appealing to the eye, like i stated in my review. That honestly happens more because of its flashy colors... Still a nice mix of traps, riddles and survival.

Leraux, for example had a lacks varying an impressing scenery. Gem of life couldn't keep me entertained while playing, it just ended so fast...

Cheerio

 

[ShadowFlare]

My vote went for Lumen

I have tried all other maps and they were all nice and all, and they all had something wrong. But in Lumen I can tell the most time was spent on it, and also has a great potential than the others. Lumen can actually become a really good game, while the others still seem like minigames to me.

Anyway Gl Ardnived.

 

[Berb]

Still a nice mix of traps, riddles and survival.

I had to repeat the map several times just to get past the first few rooms. The riddles were more a challenge of being able to bug the game and get past its flaws.

For example, when finding the books in the 2nd room, the 3rd book is completely hidden. However, you can drag your selection near the 1st book and randomly select the 3rd book (then use it).

The over-all polish that the game brought forward is less than satisfactory.

This is a mapping contest, not a "who can use fancy resources" contest. The problem with a public poll is nobody really knows what to look for, they base their opinion on personal interest. Just because nobody cares that the game bugs doesn't take away from the fact that it bugs, and is incomplete.

With the amount of time given for this contest there should be no question about whether or not certain bugs are acceptable. If there are noticeable bugs in the game the second it starts it shows that the creator paid little attention to detail, and more attention to public appeal. I suppose if that's what the contests on The Hive Workshop are about then I'll be omitting myself from future ones.

 

[Ardnived]

The Lost Temple has so many bugs I had to restart several times, yet its either in 1st or 2nd place. I started off trying to explode the wall, and I set the explosive next to it, but when I tried to blow it up it just didn't work. After restarting the game and trying it again it worked. This is a bug that should have been found well into testing, and I really don't think a game with the amount of bugs this one has should be allowed to win...

I also encountered this bug.



I am not going to vote as I have been unable to play all the maps. Several of them simply do not show up in Warcarft 3 for some reason.

But I did want to say, I played Lureax and it was very very nice, I didn't get too far, but the simplicity really added to the map. I particularly liked the starting part with Bogrull.



@ forsakener
Thanks a lot , I started about 3 days after the contest started.

 

[Kingz]

If there are noticeable bugs in the game the second it starts it shows that the creator paid little attention to detail, and more attention to public appeal.

How can you say that?

What about the people who just didn't have the time?...

 

[Berb]

Well time spent is reflected in the quality of work. Those who spent less time on it shouldn't be given a handicap on their over-all score. Everybody got the same amount of time, and it was easily enough to make a map and test it thoroughly.

The amount of time isn't even an issue though, since you don't know that Softmints could have been extremely rushed for his submission while whoever made The Lost Temple was not. Either way, quality is quality and The Lost Temple just has none. Aside from the mass resource dump, I could have coded this game in a weekend.

Or, are you saying that I should have submitted a map that just bugs and crashes right away and then suggest "its okay I was really pressed for time".

 

[real138]

berbanog shut up you have noo idea what your talking about... try producing a quality map in a week as you say you can. go PROVE IT to me and ill admit im a dumbass in BIG BOLD LETTERS. people have lives outside of wc3 and can't get everything done in such a short period of time. so please do think before you speak.

 

[A]mun]

@ Berbanog:

I agree, mostly. Everyone had the same amount of time, so it's more a neglect of the map makers, like Amigurumi, that the "final" maps have these unecessary issues.

People should learn from that, that's what a contest is also about. So thanks for pointing it out for everyone. I guess most of You knew that already...

At last: Most bugs could be ignored or avoided easily, no need to hype this criterion anyhow.

 

[Amigurumi]

@ Berbanog: I somehow think that you don't like me. I agree, there are some bugs,
and I don't had enough time to fix those/didn't noticed them.
But to say, and not only once that my map is crap, has no quality, and should be get
no points, is not true. I don't know how most of the other people think of my map,
but many tell, that it was quite nice to play (except of some flaws).
But you are trying to get my map down.
And you said that you could do this in some days, but sorry, I have a reallife,
in which I'm not sitting the whole day at my pc, and working on a contest map.
You said that you didn't found it good, so okay, I can't change your mind, but please
stop saying the whole time, that my map sucks, because it's annoying. thanks.

 

[Marcelo Hossomi]

Thanks for review and votes
(Although they're surely not enough xD)

I"ll try to make it better next time

 

[lateris]

This is a bit unexpected. I thought Arcadia would get 1 place for sure. I also voted for The Lost Treasure because it was very interesting too. And another map, i just dont remember which one, because i've done it yesterday. All the maps are great, and its hard to pick when its like that. But i told myself "not to vote for more than 3".

 

[Vengeancekael]

GO Lost Temple!! YAY <3 =3

 

[Berb]

@ Berbanog: I somehow think that you don't like me. I agree, there are some bugs,

I have no personal feeling towards you. I'm sorry if I came off harsh.

Alright, I just read up on some of the posts. Let me ease up here. I might have exaggerated myself a little bit too much because I don't mean your map is ABSOLUTE CRAP. In comparison with some of the other submissions I would say there are some serious areas of improvement, though.

I mean no offense. Real138, I don't want you to admit your stupid or whatever. I don't know why you spazzed so much. I'll eject myself from uber-critique-mode.

 

[real138]

ok i just dont like it when people say they can do something better than others can do it but never do it. i know i started out with a great map in mind but i knew i wouldn't be able to finish because for in my instance i was moving so i was without a computer for quite some time. things always come is all im saying.

 

[Berb]

I don't know why you're taking it to a personal level, it has nothing to do with how much time you had. If you had less time then you obviously won't release a map that has the extensive testing that another map would have but I don't think that you deserve extra points because of your time limitation.

I have nothing left to say about this. The contest will go on as it will, and I'll keep my opinions to myself. I'm not agreeing with you or disagreeing with you.

 

[Pooppyhead]

Here are a few more reviews

1 is terrible 5 is mediocre 10 is perfect

Also a few maps don't work and crash my wc3 so I can't review them. I don't know why but they do.

they are Dracion by X-OMG-X and Tear of Gabriel by Kingz

Anyways here are the reviews

Quest for the Lost Temple by Xiligerr

Quest for the Lost Temple by Xiliger

Ok this map really starts abruptly and there is no real story so there is no real mood. The terrain is nice but its all shown in the mini map. The custom models are nice.

The gameplay it self is really straight forward and there is no way to deviate from the path. There is also alot of mindless walking but the terrain is good so it is not too annoying.

The puzzles just seem to happen and have no setup. Some are good but most are really easy and have no thinking involved. This makes the map seem like a demo for another project. I like the levitate power but I wish there was more interaction and story. It is a really basic map and only took me 12 mins to finish.

I think it is ok but it feels like it has so much potential but then doesn't use it.

5/10

The lost treasure by Marcelo Hossomi

The lost treasure by Marcelo Hossomi

Well Crafted map I really liked the design of it. The talk and interactions as well as the items system was good. Terrain is excellent as well as the camera views. There are alot of items are some are tricky to find. The quest is pretty simple though and the plot is pretty simple. THe spirit world was pretty neat looking although I didn't like the spirits that attacked when you entered a space.

The boss battle at the end was okay besides the fact that they spawned spirits when they died. I liked the darkness of the levels and the shading alot. It really added to the mood of the game. That one puzzle was really well thought out and I enjoyed it much.

I finished it pretty quickly but I did want more to interact with. I felt it unnecessary to interact and talk to be different buttons when you really could of combined the buttons. The ending and credits were good. the only thing missing would be more story and interactions with things but since its only a competition I think it worked well. Saving and loading the game also screws up the chat system though so I had to restart.

7/10

 

[Waldbaer]

@De.Facto: I just wanted to try out your map on my mac:

Well, this is not what it should look like, is it? Is this an OpenGL issue? Is it known or does even anybody know how to correct it? Thanks for your help!

 

[De.Facto]

@De.Facto: I just wanted to try out your map on my mac:
Well, this is not what it should look like, is it? Is this an OpenGL issue? Is it known or does even anybody know how to correct it? Thanks for your help!

Uhm, well. Sorry.

At first, the UI. Please change to full screen.

I guess the fog-settings are displayed in a different way. The weird thing is: you can set any Z-Start / -Endings - the crystal-models are visible the whole time.
There's only one fog-setting for the meta-level.

It seems I've to calibrate the settings for Mac. I'll change this within the next update.

 

[Dr. House]

Now i dont think a map with custom models should be infront of one who doesnt cause i respect it more if you create a nice map without custom stuff so my vote gos to a map without custom models anyone knows who made a map without that ?

 

[Waldbaer]

Uhm, well. Sorry.

At first, the UI. Please change to full screen.

I guess the fog-settings are displayed in a different way. The weird thing is: you can set any Z-Start / -Endings - the crystal-models are visible the whole time.
There's only one fog-setting for the meta-level.

It seems I've to calibrate the settings for Mac. I'll change this within the next update.

OK, I tested it on our PC and it works fine, also under Open GL... really interesting. I only changed to window mode to prevent having to scale the screenshot, it looked the same way fullscreen just with 1920x1200 Pixels.
Thanks for taking care of the few freaks using the mac version.

 

[Ardnived]

OK, I tested it on our PC and it works fine, also under Open GL... really interesting. I only changed to window mode to prevent having to scale the screenshot, it looked the same way fullscreen just with 1920x1200 Pixels.
Thanks for taking care of the few freaks using the mac version.

I am using a mac and I have not even been able to play it, doesn't show up in Warcraft 3. Though on that matter it doesn't work on my Windows Boot Camp either. :|

 

[Waldbaer]

I don't know why, but sometimes War3 doesn't like too long and complicated map file names which results in the map not showing up at all. I had the same problem; just change the file name to something simple like "Arcadia.w3x" and it will work.

 

[Deolrin]

You'll have to shorten the filename.

EDIT: Sorry, didn't see Waldbaer's post.

 

[De.Facto]

You'll have to shorten the filename.

Something like arcadiariseandfallbeta without any numbers, or points.

 

[RED BARON]

Now I don't think a map with custom models should be in-front of one who doesn't cause i respect it more if you create a nice map without custom stuff so my vote gos to a map without custom models anyone knows who made a map without that ?

You could play the maps and find out - Kinda hard to judge who made a nice map without checking.

 

[Syleona]

The final reviews on the Solo Mapping Contest 3 should be up in the Arena section during the weekend, latest.

It's a bit hard to judge the maps, as there are some really great ones - and making a decision is not the easiest.

 

[Pyritie]

PM them to me when you're done ;P

 

[Ardnived]

Has the judging been concluded yet?


You know I really feel like taking another crack at a contest like this. Not necessarily Puzzles or Singleplayer, but like an adventure map.

 

[Syleona]

I'm working on it. Sorry for my delay, but the stuff around real life really got me this time. And making a review for all these maps is not doable in a short time.

I'll probably shorten down the reviews actually. I planned to do a more indepth one, but I'll just do a short one for now.

 

[real138]

does that mean you haven't started? jw

 

[Kingz]

Oh well good luck to all of the participants

I realised i ain't fit for these kind of large scale competitions and shouldn't have participated in the first place

I will just stick to writing things in JASS and maybe making some silly terrains...

 

[Syleona]

I did start it, and have about half of them done. I originally wanted to write a really detailed review but my time won't let me. So instead I'll write a summary for every map.

 

[real138]

aha ok.

 

[Ardnived]

I did start it, and have about half of them done. I originally wanted to write a really detailed review but my time won't let me. So instead I'll write a summary for every map.

Thats a shame
I would have preferred a more detailed review, as I am sure we all would of.

 

[Amigurumi]

Syleona, how long do you need for it?
I don't want to hurry, but it's quite a time ago, since the contest ended.

Maybe you could post your progress? Like, how much (%) you already did.
Thanks