[Defense / Survival] Hero Siege RPG

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

@AwesomeGuy
Hai, thanks for the feedback


In other news
I found a hacked version of my map, where the creator replaced all the hero models with anime girls for some reason lol.

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

I'd die to see Illidan as an anime girl.

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

Who wouldn't

 

[AwesomeGuy]

map name? xd

 

[AwesomeGuy]

new version again?

 

[AwesomeGuy]

You know, i thought about it, and i have an idea for a new hero,Thrall, His Evolves As the Earth-Warder in WoW catalysm.
Btw Arthas can spam dire wolves now. with his ability cost 0 mana

Another thing, i played lothar few times (took me time till i got rid of noobs and finally got my ult) And i find him very good, op.
And the ult is bugged, there is no CD for it! i can just spam it.
I didnt abuse it myself (most of the time xd)
and it has a slight casting time, which sucks coz you need to use that ability as fast as possible to resore hp (you would want to have low hp before you use it).
and you dont get the +12 attack bonus as well. Note that this ability isnt that good so dont give it too long CD.
And he gets even more op when he gets frostmourne hungers ability (ikr wtf.) with it combined with his E ability (he has infite mana and regen hp like a madman).

And i have got another suggestion (not mine tbh, other player's)
Reduced CD for ressurect if only 1 player is ressurected.

I have played a game with a good team i played as lothar(all new to the map, but still, we played good).
We killed boss very easily, barely died, We even killed blademaster without any death.
Unfourtnally We died at xavius, he had litterally 1% hp (even less) and i had low hp, but i didnt want to abuse my ult coz i already used it once, and i thought we are going to win anyway, but as soon as i died they all got one shoted by xavius in two seconds and malf died as soon as he ressurected. Damn we were so close to win, we could even kill kazzak i think, just unlucky with xavius.

 

[Eric Reider]

Hey map maker i do have idea for the Healer bring heroes back can't it be a cd for each hero til the healer can bring them back for each hero alone cause the wait for all of them seems to be a little unfair for the other heroes if they are dead as well

 

[NailBigGreen]

Hey map maker i do have idea for the Healer bring heroes back can't it be a cd for each hero til the healer can bring them back for each hero alone cause the wait for all of them seems to be a little unfair for the other heroes if they are dead as well

It was like that before. Not entirely sure as to why he needed to change it. I mean, sure. With the choose heroes thing... But he could just make unit group array or a unit array

 

[AwesomeGuy]

It was like that before. Not entirely sure as to why he needed to change it. I mean, sure. With the choose heroes thing... But he could just make unit group array or a unit array

No, i was lower mana cost, but same CD.

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

Original idea was to give each healer hero a different resurrection ability.
EBD has yet to comment on that.

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

You know, i thought about it, and i have an idea for a new hero,Thrall, His Evolves As the Earth-Warder in WoW catalysm.
Btw Arthas can spam dire wolves now. with his ability cost 0 mana

Thanks for the suggestions i'll lthats a good idea

Another thing, i played lothar few times (took me time till i got rid of noobs and finally got my ult) And i find him very good, op.
And the ult is bugged, there is no CD for it! i can just spam it.
I didnt abuse it myself (most of the time xd)
and it has a slight casting time, which sucks coz you need to use that ability as fast as possible to resore hp (you would want to have low hp before you use it).
and you dont get the +12 attack bonus as well. Note that this ability isnt that good so dont give it too long CD.
And he gets even more op when he gets frostmourne hungers ability (ikr wtf.) with it combined with his E ability (he has infite mana and regen hp like a madman).

Thanks for the report i'll fix the issues as soon as possible (Which will not be soon, because the editor doesn't work anymore). Also thanks for the suggestions. I will take them into account

And i have got another suggestion (not mine tbh, other player's)
Reduced CD for ressurect if only 1 player is ressurected.

Hey map maker i do have idea for the Healer bring heroes back can't it be a cd for each hero til the healer can bring them back for each hero alone cause the wait for all of them seems to be a little unfair for the other heroes if they are dead as well

I thought about doing that, I think it was even implemented in one of the older versions, but it was just too OP. There was no longer any real penalty for dying, so i set it to the way it is now.
By the way, welcome to the community @Eric Reider

Original idea was to give each healer hero a different resurrection ability.
EBD has yet to comment on that.

I'm just very lazy! lol. Also i'm only 1 guy with limited WE knowledge it's not always easy doing it . As you can see by the bugs found every version!

 

[NailBigGreen]

I'm just very lazy! lol. Also i'm only 1 guy with limited WE knowledge it's not always easy doing it . As you can see by the bugs found every version!

You could always burden us who would like to help, I mean... This will sound cooler "We're sworn to carry your burden".

 

[AwesomeGuy]

EBD lol

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

Lothar seems fairly imbalanced, I'll take a closer look soon. His teleport thingy can target invulnerable enemies tho, which it shouldn't, since he can teleport to elementals in Antonidas room.

 

[AwesomeGuy]

Lothar seems fairly imbalanced, I'll take a closer look soon. His teleport thingy can target invulnerable enemies tho, which it shouldn't, since he can teleport to elementals in Antonidas room.

True, he is very strong And tp is such a huge bug. Im trying not to abuse it too much.
But you see, Arthas is fairly op as well. Tank heroes are always the strongest.
But he does need a small nerf.

 

[NailBigGreen]

I mean, if bacon wants to I could always fix things like this, but I'll wait until he tells me to

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

Lothar seems fairly imbalanced, I'll take a closer look soon. His teleport thingy can target invulnerable enemies tho, which it shouldn't, since he can teleport to elementals in Antonidas room.

Yeah I am aware of that bug, but there is no condition that checks if a unit is invulenrable, so it would be complicated to fix it!

I mean, if bacon wants to I could always fix things like this, but I'll wait until he tells me to

Thanks for the offer . I will def get in touch if i need some herlp

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

In your base spell, there should be tickable "Targets Allowed" where you can pre-set it.

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

Yeah, but unfortunately the base spell doesn't have anything to do with the teleport mechanic. The base spell is roar, the tele mechanic is done all through triggers

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

Could instead be reworked to be a Blink Strike kind of ability, where he teleports to a desired target. If it's an ally, grants it armor bonus for a while. If it's an enemy, reduces it.

 

[NailBigGreen]

You should have used a buff (such as bloodlust) with a 0 cast time. Just remove all the buffs from it and effects. Then you would be able to make it target only non-invul

 

[AwesomeGuy]

Its not that big porblem anyway

 

[AwesomeGuy]

So, suggestion for next versions:
-Nerf Ent boss, you buffed him too much.
-Alleria boss is so over powered, you have no idea how many times i failed there. 2 people dies at the start of the room and her multi arrow kills everyone except tank.
-Reduce Paladin (first dungeon boss) Clap aoe, it gets everyone, and you cant hide from it if you have low hp.
-Blademaster nerf again, I mean, he has high hp, High Damage, And very fast attack speed. Oh, And there are three of that guy. I usually play at the tank arthas/lothar and i cant hold more than few seconds against him.
-Reduce Malganis' Infernals hp, but increase Malganis HP.
-Reduce Watcher hero Armor, so she will die much quicker.
-Reduce Damage done by Chain lighting (done by damned mages in first waves) with the finger of death model. Same with Priest Forken lighting.
-Increase Boss Level In Quelthalas for more XP.
-Add more runes at these rooms: Alleria, Cenarius, Xavius.
-More Epic Items! The Lategame boss doesnt drop items at all, i got few suggestions myself:
-Horn of cenarius (Int item, for Jaina/malf) dropped from cenarius. Gives bonus INT and a chance when casting a spell to reset all spells.
-Orb of darkness (for illidan) dropped from tichondrius.Gives bonus hp, and attack damage. Can be used to give the user bonus armor for a short time.
-Orcish Armor (for grom) Dropped from blademaster. Gives bonus str and stats. can be used to refill some mana. long cd.
This all items i got for now, but there should be more, some items could be just very weak and without anything special. But after a long fight against a boss you would expect for a reward.
Lothar nerfs (he is a bit too op)
-Reduce his Q ability damage from 90 per level, to 60 per level (in evolve it stays 100).
-Remove frostmourne hungers ability, combined with his passive means infinte mana.
-About his Charge ability (D): Reduce HP regen to 5 before evolve (after evolve its 10), hmm, and thats all? maybe reduce armor?
-increase mana cost for his Mend (W) to 100 or so.
-Reduce Alliance (E) CD.
-Buff his Ultimate a bit, lets say increases his Attack by 40-60 for 12 seconds? Or very low CD, Like 20 - 40. because TBH, its a nice Ultimate.

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

@AwesomeGuy
Very nice list of suggestions thank you for the feedback!
-I will nerf the ent and alleria boss, but not a lot. They are beatable and I don't want to revert them to just auto -attack-until-win bosses I like the challenge, but I realise I may have gone too far
-I don't feel like the paladin boss really needs a nerf in his thunder clap, but I am planning to grant vision of his zone while you fight him, I think new players will stop dying there once they see the 2 flames
-I haven't encountered much trouble with the blademaster, I feel like he is challenging, without being overpowered, but I will look into this.
-Whats the problem with the current malganis set-up? I feel like its reasonably easy for a first boss. People don't usually die versus him, which is the intent
-I feel like the watcher hero does die quickly already, but has a very strong damage to compensate, people don't usually die to her either, but i'll take a look
-I also feel like the chain lightning damage is reasonable, people who die against those waves, are simply people who aren't paying attention.
-Why should quel'thalas boss give more exp?
-That's a good idea, I will add some more runes to those bosses
-Yeah I am working on some more epic items, but I'm jsut very lazy, I'll get around to it eventually
I really like thos items suggestions though, I will take thme into account
-Yeah Lothar may need some rebalancing, I will look into it once I get the editor running again!

Thanks again for the suggestions I really appreciate them

 

[AwesomeGuy]

Dont get me wrong, i love the challenge. But some boss are impossible and no matter how high your skill you cant win, such as alleria and blademaster. But i did passed them few times. so i guess it possible. but still.
Everything is possible, but some stuff are too op and need a small nerf to balance.
Malganis so easy boss. you can litterally aim him and then infenals and you shouldnt, in my opinion. maybe reduce his attack and attack speed. Make him a bit more challenging.
People do die against Watcher, if tank fucks a bit. Just a small nerf.
people do pay attention against this chain lightnings. and when they try run with low hp the chain gets them. maybe decrease its range.
Why not give quelthalas boss more xp? they give such a low amount.
I tried to balance the items and fit them to some heroes that are missing epic and special items. I had more than few games Grom/illidan rq because lack of items.
Just dont nerf him too much. Some would say that Arthas better. Its just that Tank is always stronger than the usuall,

 

[NailBigGreen]

@Eat_Bacon_Daily The JNGP (Jass new gen pack) world editor no longer works for making maps, there is a fix, but it didn't work for me so, I downloaded a new one that hasn't gotten all the features yet... Probably will have to use it for now though. And I can't terrain my usual terrain in it so I can't finish one of the zones, but it was mostly done. Once the first alpha version of that map is out I'll post it on the site for you to see if you want to (I'm not trying to advertise... It was just related to it)

 

[AwesomeGuy]

Some more bugs and work for you:
-If all heroes dies except one in a dungeon and that one guy manage to defeat the boss alone, all players except purple are ressurected (except the first dungeon).
-And If one of the dead players that ressurected was the next to evolve, he doesnt get his evolve and just contiues.
-Decrease attack speed on doom lords.
-reduce Feedback on Demonic units in Xavius room.
-reduce attack damage and hp and armor on Overlords (op af mate, each one of them is a boss of his own, 30k hp and 2k siege attack. thats crazy. And time between waves is very short.
-Remove or atleast nerf skeletons summoned by Xavius. They ruin the whole consept of One tank and supports. i know you believe that other players shouldnt count on one tank but these skeletons has very high attack and hp and cannot be tanken alone.
-Reduce hp on Moon furbolgs (i think that this is how they called), the furblogs that does starfall. Its very hard to aim them down if you dont have stun.
-Instead of orb of shadows that i suggested before it can be called horn of balanzzar, obviously because it drops off blanazzar.
-Trees of life in waves and in at mini games room drop runes.
-New buff that can be add at the orange priest (just a suggestion): Damage buff. Increase all allies damage by 40% or so, for 10 seconds. This will make fight against Watcher, Blademaster, and Nethrazim easier. it will have cd of 15 or so, and will cost something around 30 gold.
-reduce mana cost of buff from priest !!
-Increase kaelthalas damage.
-Reduce attack speed of the two top boss. and increase damage and add splash damage for the other one in south.
-Give Mannaroth 70% cleve attack but reduce his attack damage.
-Reduce Cenarius boss hp regen, it is too crazy. sometimes it takes hours to kill him, and in SP its impossible.

Sorry for all these suggestions i play this game too often

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

Moon furbolgs are fine as they are.
If you have a Furion in your team, he can easily stun them from the "Guard tower" pillars, but Jaina can't unless she teleports on them and wastes a heal to stun them. Yet, on orc waves, Furion can't disable casters properly while Jaina very safely can. It's a matter of choice - you're gonna have one of those two easier depends on the hero purple plays.

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

Thanks for the feedback man

-If all heroes dies except one in a dungeon and that one guy manage to defeat the boss alone, all players except purple are
-And If one of the dead players that ressurected was the next to evolve, he doesnt get his evolve and just contiues.

Hmm thats strange, I will have to look into it. Do you remember what hero purple was playing?

-reduce Feedback on Demonic units in Xavius room.

I will consider it

-reduce attack damage and hp and armor on Overlords (op af mate, each one of them is a boss of his own, 30k hp and 2k siege attack. thats crazy. And time between waves is very short.

Yeah, they are menat to be kind of mini-bosses, but perhaps I made them too difficult

-Remove or atleast nerf skeletons summoned by Xavius. They ruin the whole consept of One tank and supports. i know you believe that other players shouldnt count on one tank but these skeletons has very high attack and hp and cannot be tanken alone.

The skeles only spawn if you attack him after he has casted an ability. But maybe they do hit too hard.

-Reduce hp on Moon furbolgs (i think that this is how they called), the furblogs that does starfall. Its very hard to aim them down if you dont have stun.

Furbolgs aren't too difficult to deal with in my opinion

-Instead of orb of shadows that i suggested before it can be called horn of balanzzar, obviously because it drops off blanazzar.
-Trees of life in waves and in at mini games room drop runes.
-New buff that can be add at the orange priest (just a suggestion): Damage buff. Increase all allies damage by 40% or so, for 10 seconds. This will make fight against Watcher, Blademaster, and Nethrazim easier. it will have cd of 15 or so, and will cost something around 30 gold.

Good ideas. I will consider them

-Increase kaelthalas damage.
-Reduce attack speed of the two top boss. and increase damage and add splash damage for the other one in south.
-Give Mannaroth 70% cleve attack but reduce his attack damage.
-Reduce Cenarius boss hp regen, it is too crazy. sometimes it takes hours to kill him, and in SP its impossible.

Also interesting ideas, I will check them out. Though i think mannoroth is fine the way he is

Thanks for your suggestions tho, I really appreciate them

 

[AwesomeGuy]

Malfurion was the hero purple played.

 

[nmphuong91]

Alleria of the 2nd dungeon? I thought she is pretty weak.

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

You must be korean

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

Malfurion was the hero purple played.

Thanks ^^

Alleria of the 2nd dungeon? I thought she is pretty weak.

Hahah, have you played v.29? i buffed her in that version and she is pretty hard to deal with, if your team isn't coordinated

 

[nmphuong91]

Yes, it's .29 version. She can't do anything but AA and Wind Walk. So we only have to chase her. No one lost 50% hp or more...
Blademaster is killing us, tho. That 1500 chaos damage shred tank, even if it's Arthas with 4000 hp and 22 armor.
Tyrande complaining about not getting her Glyph skill (used Glyph, got nothing).
Cenarius was easy because of Arthas...tho I guess it would be a lot longer without him.

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

@nmphuong91
Thanks for the report and the feedback! It's always appreciated! May I confirm that you were playing v0.29b and not v0.29, because the tyrande glyph ability should have been resolved in the v0.29b version.

 

[nmphuong91]

Ah yes, we are playing 0.29b. Look like the bug still there.

 

[AwesomeGuy]

@nmphuong91 Your name in Wc3? I would like to play with you mate. Alleria is usually easy, but sometimes she is hard. I wish i had skilled team every game.

 

[nmphuong91]

@nmphuong91 Your name in Wc3? I would like to play with you mate. Alleria is usually easy, but sometimes she is hard. I wish i had skilled team every game.

I am nmphuong91 on Garena.

 

[AwesomeGuy]

Garena... I see. is that your name in wc3 too?

 

[nmphuong91]

Warcraft 3? If that mean battle.net, I am not on battle.net. The ingame name when I play on Garena is nmphuong91 too.

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

@nmphuong91
Hai iv'e been getting a lot of feedback from garena players recently. May I ask how popular is the map over on that server? Does it get hosted it a lot and do the lobbies fill up fast?

 

[Notorious.Jack]

I just discovered this map and i LOOOOOVEEEE it. Been playing it with my gf, and we are having a blast. Not sure how far can we get to but really great job on the map dude, tnx for your effort and creativity!

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

Wow, thank you so much for your kind words. Crazy how just a few words can really light up someones day, like yours did to me . How far have you guys made it and where do you guys play? If you are looking for more people to play with you could always play using makemehost.com's hosting service for battle.net, you'll get a full lobby pretty quick there.
Thanks again for your kind words

 

[Notorious.Jack]

Wow, thank you so much for your kind words. Crazy how just a few words can really light up someones day, like yours did to me . How far have you guys made it and where do you guys play? If you are looking for more people to play with you could always play using makemehost.com's hosting service for battle.net, you'll get a full lobby pretty quick there.
Thanks again for your kind words

We play at home , the 2 of us. Need to buy wc3 for bnet since i lost my keys few years ago. As you said it before, this game is made for 4+, but as 2 we are at hmmmi the part where u dodge footies with lighting. Thanks for the info and have a nice day I will write to you when i finish it a few times , cheeers

 

[Apheraz Lucent]

There are other gaming platforms, such as Garena and GameRanger which allow you to create and join games in their own LAN networks, regardless of whether your Wc3 copy is original or not.

I myself use GameRanger mostly for Diablo 2, but the Wc3 community is still big there.

 

[nmphuong91]

@nmphuong91
Hai iv'e been getting a lot of feedback from garena players recently. May I ask how popular is the map over on that server? Does it get hosted it a lot and do the lobbies fill up fast?

Can't speak for the community, but the map is not very popular. I haven't seen any host other than our's. The lobbies fill up fast, but we won't reach the end of d1. The Garena player at my favorite room always join game with few slot. But it's hard to keep them with the difficulty, the slow power progress, and the indefinite dead time. The last one is the best pub-killing mechanism, pub player won't stay when the answer to "When would I get ressurected?" is "When we clear the first dungeon, 20' later probably". And most player treat death lightly until they are dead. May be it would help if you make a warning on loading screen or when picking hero.

And so, we are only playing this map with our clan member...

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

Hello friends.
I still don't have access to the map through JNGP, but iv'e noticed a lot of people stalking the thread so I decided that i'll make a little post to keep you fine folks up to date.

So here are known bugs of version 0.29b that i'm planning to fix!
-Periapt of vitality gives mana instead of health
-Lothar's ult (R) causes an in-game message showing the damage and currently has no cooldown
-Lothar's (Q) penetrates magic immunity
-Tyrande sometimes fails to unlock her new spell (F)
-Malfurion/Jaina do not revive at the end of a dungeon
-Malfurion/Jaina's items all drop when they die
-Scoreboard fails to register kills done through triggers

Here are some things i'm planning on doing for v.30 (though I may not end up implementing all of these due to lack of map making skills or time)
-Make lothar's (D) a target spell instead of an automatic cast (Means you'll have to target the unit you want to blink to instead of the gaming randomly picking for you)
-Reword illidan's entangle (Entangle is a weird spell for illidan to have, I will likely make him get a spell with a similar effect, but visually diffierent from entangle, suggestions are welcome)
-Rework Grom's base from (He's currently the least fun hero to play in my opinion and many people don't like playing him compared to other heroes)
-Rework the Kazzak dungeon room
-Add another dungeon room. (I don't want to give too much away, but if all works well, it will be a large area with multiple towns where you will have to capture and control points while archimonde sends waves of enemies on you and tries to steal capture points away from you)
-Nerf a little the first wave creeps, such as the ghouls & skeles or add a revive checkpoint after malganis (Too many people die before reaching the first dungeon and end up quitting)
-Give vision of the entire Paladin boss room (Too many first timers fail to see the second fire and die here, so this should help them out)
-Slightly tone down the power of 2nd dungeon Tree boss and Alleria boss
-reduce effectiveness of divine armor vs hero damage
-Also I will be considering a bunch of the feedbakc/suggestions previously mentionned by @AwesomeGuy that were previously mentionned

Also iv'e i'm toying with the idea of a discord channel to help people who want to get together and play. So i created a discord for the map, but if too few people join i'll close it down. I want to avoid having just an empty discord channel that no one uses. Here is the link Discord, I'll close it down in a month or so if too few people use it/join.

 

[AwesomeGuy]

As far as i know, Garena players can join ENT bots. If i will see enough players from Garena I might start hosting on ENT instead of mmh myself (even tho it sucks).
Also i have something to say. The map is intended to be very hard. You got to play it multile times to have a chance of defeating. Im having a very hard time myself with so many pub players. I got my own tricks to keep them in the game and find good players.

And for v.30. I love it. everything you said is needed and will look awesome. For Grom, I do like to play with him sometimes, he is a fun hero sometimes. But he do need a rework. He lacks with items and his role isnt clear (Dps? Second tank? wave cleaner?).

 

[Inthebag]

Don't really have a clue about what Garena is, but i sometimes hosted this via bots in battle.net and often found people to play it, even tho i often feel uneasy to play with pubs, or either i get bored/ i don't get as much far as i do in some pubs. If there is a clan for such things in bnet, i'm willing to join it to have some fun with this awesome map

 

[Eat_Bacon_Daily]

@Inthebag Hai thank you so much for your kind words man . Really appreciate it! If you are looking for folks, you could join the discord i setup recently, there is a fair number of folks in there or you could add me Eat_Bacon_Daily on Nothrend (Eu) or Azeroth USeast.
Discord link = Discord